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My reply: Respect an individual's decision : Shashi Tharoor
My reply to Shashi Tharoor's article in Times of India on 5th Oct 2008: Respect an individual's decision
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Columnists/S_Tharoor_Respect_a_persons_choice/articleshow/3561097.cms
Shashi I am really disappointed, not because I differ in views from you or we have a difference in opinion, but because the basic premise on which you have made this argument by categorising all those people who don’t agree with you or with the missionaries as ‘Hindu Zealots’ or ‘Hindu Thugs’. Is this the kind of language we will be expecting from you or you think that you can win people by being abusive.
This entire issue started when one of our leader Swamy lakshmananand was killed along with 4 other Sanyasies and a 60 year old Sadhvi on Janmastmi in a hostel for girls in a remote hamlet in Kandhmal. It’s a well known fact that Swamy Ji was working to restore Hinduism in tribal belt, by your logic conversion and re-conversion shall not be an issue, then why he was attacked 9 times and finally killed. I agree with you violence can not be justified, but shall we wear bangles in our hands, and see our leaders being attacked, killed and there bodies mutilated, because violence can not be justified.
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Note: Content of this blog post is writer's personal opinion and may not be SanghParivar.org or Sangh's view.
I agree with you murder and rape doesn’t have any religion, but this bigotry applies only to Hindu Thugs. By the way if you try to be a bit objective and see the case of Orissa, Swami ji was working among Tribal population, these people are not educated and you can not expect to have a measured response from the Tribal community for the Ghastly massacre of Swami Ji. There are certain more fact’s, the cases of rape are considerably high in Tribal communities, you can check the statistics from Rajasthan/ MP / Jharkhand or any where. You made a very strong point about the constitution; I don’t know if you have read the entire constitution, neither those tribal communities know much about the Indian constitution.
The Tribal community knew a frail old man, yet strong in character and determination working among them and opening up educational institutions telling them about there great past, trying to preserve there religion, identity and there way of living. He must be given BharatRatna, Does any of our political leaders including you have the courage to go to a remote tribal hamlet and work for the rest of your life over there. No, because people like you are well articulated hypocrites, they are excellent in doing lip-service, and may have an excellent career ahead. But for Tribal’s swamy ji was next to god, he was not doing any lip-service, he was living and working among them. If a white skinned Mother Teresa (with all due respect) who worked for Missionaries of Charity, with a sole purpose of converting people to Christianity can get a BharatRatna, then this brown frail old man working among the Tribal’s since last 4 decades deserves one.
I agree with you, let every Indian have the right to choose his faith, but create a level playing field first. Let’s stop all the foreign funding to these missionaries. If there faith is so strong then they will not need any money to convert people.
Jai Ram Ji Ki,
Satyajeet Shukla
Swayam Sevak
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Comments
Dear Satyajeet, Please call
Dear Satyajeet,
Please call me Johnson. I would be honoured if you do read my blog. If it doesnot load after clicking the link it is searchable on google by typing in Recovery of the Kohinnoor Diamond or by typing in Johnson Thomas Karingozhakal....and then clicking search with omitted results included...Please appreciate that it is not as intellectually inspiring as your blogs but my purpose was to lightern the theme a little so that an ordinary English reader find it simple....and appreciate the depth of denigration of Indian Civilisation and Expropriation of Indian Heritage under the duress of British Colonial occupation of India.
Dear Devadass, The
Dear Devadass,
The re-conversion of 59 million out of 60 million so called Christians in the UK ought to happen first. If we look at any encyclopedia worth its salt they say a third of UK population is affiliated to one of the two protestant churches etc etc....there are only 1 million church goers in the UK. Many churches are being sold off and one former church in Nottingham is a pub.....do the conversion there. I firmly believe that Hinduism is a tolerant religion to where Jews, Christians, Parsies etc when they were prosecuted sought asylum centuries ago. Misleading poor, vulnerable and illiterate people in the tribal areas by ridiculing Hindu gods and goddesses and then securing conversion is not with the Informed Consent of the converted. Please read Stephen Mitchell's English translation of the Bhagavat Gita....let Christians in India have the guts to proclaim the truth that Mahabharatha is eight times bigger than Illiad and Odyssey instead of belittling Indian Civilisation. I love Jesus Christ because he did not convert anyone in to Christianity. He was a rebel Jewish Rabbi who was born as a Jew, circumcised as Jew, buried as a Jew and he hid not feel the need to establish an organised religion. Let Indian Christians have the guts to say Christianity is not a Western religion but an Asian religion. Let the Catholic Bishop's conference declare that Church and State should separate itself in Vatican...(a UN member), Let Indian Christians have the guts to say that the British Queen; the Head of State ought not to be the Supreme Governor of the Chruch of England. Let the post of Archbishop of Canterbury go to the Nigerian congregation as they are the largest Anglican community in the world by numbers. Let the Pope be from Brazil which is the largest Catholic country in the world. If it is secular to use the Bible Belt in America for American Presidential elections it is fair game to use Hindutva in politics too.
But the best option is to separate religion from State and government should not run temples, Wakhaf boards etc.....we are all Indians whatever be our religion. If we are bickering it is because we are victims of Divide and Rule policy introduced by the British. I sometimes sympathise with the peoples of India, Israel, Pakistan and Palestine because they are all victims of the British Divide and Rule policy....every Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Sikh, Jain, Budhist, Parsi ought to realise this truth....from this we learn to respect each other and their way of worship instead of conversion and number games. Let Christians also make the priests who have abused children in their schools and colleges in India like the Pope did to the victims of sexual abuse by Catholic priests and bishops in the USA. These are all part of Jesus' teachings. Jesus' fight was against the established religion in those days in Israel.....
Shuklaji please read the
Shuklaji please read the scholarlly article JESUS:GOD or FRAUD carried on the Sanghparivar.org with the article christianity and racism,see the compelling historical evidence and decide who is a lunatic.Have courage of your conviction as a true swayam sevak to know what compels a true christian to share the message with others.If all you want is that our great mother land to be a pre-eminent nation in the world why don't you accept good from christians.If RSS is a cultural organization why poke their nose in religious matters?.Is serving the poor because of God's commandment wrong?,because of gratitude and role modelling people adopt the faith of their benefactors do you consider that as forced/induced conversion?.Were not Jesus listeners of first century not simple people who responded to his love,they were offered nothing except persecution and humiliation.Relatively Swayam sevaks are non-corrupt,they can rule through BJP as long as they wish provided they give up the idea that christians are anti-national,dalits are impure and backward classes are arrogant.When a dalit/tribal experiences love and acceptance of christians because of the message of love preached by Jesus,he goes and tells others of his community and the goodness is spread.Why anyone should call Evil good and good Evil?.If people are liberated from costly rituals and unfounded fears and bad habits why to attack the people who give them hope.Do you strongly believe that christians are arsonists and planned the killing of Swamiji,action reaction theory is justified by terrorists also. Do you really believe that a Maoist kills for the sake of religion of his birth.Why not treat people with different ideas of God has an idealogical opponents instead of an enemies.Let there be civility even when we do not agree with each other. Where christinas are in a majority did they attack anyone because their co-religionists are suffering.Is it possible for the good to come out of evil roots.What is the eternal consequence that a christian faces if sanathan dharma in it's pure form is true in all it's assertions,will he not reach God inview of all paths to the same destiny theory.What if in equal probabilty christ is true in all his claims being God human in flesh.
Dear DevaDas, I have seen a
Dear DevaDas,
I have seen a lot of questions that you have raised, I am replying some of them, which are worth replying.
>Is serving the poor because of God's commandment wrong?
No, it is not, but vilification of any religion or the way of life is definitely wrong. We are not against Christianity as a religion or against Jesus Christ. For me Jesus is another God, He fought against the evils of the Jewish religion of his time.
Look at the history of institutionalised Christianity; it was spread by Romans into the Europe by the vilification of the local religion of Pagans and heathens. There local culture and tradition’s how-ever sublime they may be were demonised in the pretext of witch-craft. The people who were responsible for the decimation of red Indians in America were Christians only. Jesus will never forgive you for these crime’s.
Please be objective, you can’t dissociate yourself from the crimes that the organised Christianity had perpetrated against the human civilization. The bloody conversion of Goa by Portuguese happened in India only .I can quote Robert Mugabe the president of Zimbabwe when he came to India,
“When Missionaries came they have the Bible and we have the Land, Now they have all the Land and we are left with Bible”.
My dear friend do you really think that, after the entire Africa had turned to Christianity, people in Africa have became affluent and more civilized. It is a Mith, people and nation can not become great unless they feel proud about there culture there tradition, there forefather’s and every thing associated with there land.
>Because of gratitude and role modelling people adopt the faith of their benefactors do you consider that as forced/induced conversion?
If this is the only truth then I will not consider it as forced conversion (still it is an induced conversion) but there is more to this. I know poor people, there kids were given free admission to the missionary school and in the mid of the session they were told to convert or they need to pay the fees. Is it not forced conversion?
>Relatively Swayam sevaks are non-corrupt,they can rule through BJP as long as they wish provided they give up the idea that christians are anti-national,dalits are impure and backward classes are arrogant.
Please refrain from putting your words into my mouth. Swayam Sevaks are non corrupt is OK, but after that what ever you have said is just crap.
>Do you strongly believe that Christians are arsonists and planned the killing of Swamiji?
Yes I know that they have killed Swamy ji. This was not the first attack on his life; he had been attacked many times.
>Action reaction theory is justified by terrorists also.
I am not justifying the action reaction theory, I have said in my post violence can not be justified what ever may be the pretext. But my entire argument was against the Shashi’s assertion regarding the Hindu Thugs and You can not expect a measured response from the illetrate trible's.
Jai Ram Ji ki,
Satyajeet Shukla
Swayam Sevak
Dear Mr Thomas, This is how
Dear Mr Thomas,
This is how Indian Christians should respond to the present crisis, created by missioneries.They are not concerned about safety,security,prosperity of ordinary Christians.They only want to carry out diktats issued from the Vetican.This is how some of the Jihadis are operating.They follow the diktats of ISI or some Jihadi outfits located elsewhere.And look what is happening to ordinary Muslims ! all of them are looked at with suspicion.If missioneries continue their destructive programmes,similar fate can befall on entire Christian community.It is time, Christians let this be known to their " Fathers" and " Sisters" who appear ever eager to harvest the souls of illiterate tribals.
Shashi Taroor totally
Shashi Taroor totally ignores the vicious game behind conversions. I am a devout Christin who prays everyday. The Christian establishment first converted Jesus Christ in to a European to hide his Asian lineage. Look at the idols and pictures of Jesus Christ circulated in India although Jesus opposed idol worship. Israel for most people in the UK including the educated ones is in "Middle East" and Asians are only people from India, Pakistan, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka.
The second aspect of viciousness of the Christian conversion is that the foreign missionaries and their coterie in India want to convert only the poor, vulnerable, illiterate in tribal areas and not in metros. The motive of the missionaries is simple- "go to tribal areas and we can mislead them about Hinduism and secure their conversions". If the missionaries were to mislead Hindus about Hinduism in the Indian Metros they would be shown the door by even European or American educated Hindus.
The third aspect of viciousness of Christin conversion is that the Europeans and Americans don't want to reconvert all the Christians in their own countries who have left the church.
The fourth aspect is that the Christian missionaries do not want to convert Muslims either in India or Saudi Arabia or UAE or any other Muslim country but only Hindus and Budhists because both religions are pacifist in nature.
Communism wants the destruction of Indian Heritage so it can convert people politically and make them Marx and Lenin worshippers, Christian and Muslim establishments too want the weakening of Hindu philosophy, their unique greatness, achievements and philosophers so that they can install their saints and scientists from Europe and Saudi Arabia to create subservience amongst Indians. Ask Shashi Taroor to look at two case studies- one of Japan a modern Budhist country and Philippines a former Budhist but now a Christian country and their respective standings in world affairs, geopolitics, economy, scientific achievements etc etc. This is what conversion does.
I wrote in the letters to editor columns of several Indian English news papers who don't want to publish the sentiments of this Christian about conversion by missionaries. This is because until the British groomed mind set is given up subservience of the English in all forms including before BBC, and News Agencies would continue.
I have a blog on Indian Heritage and the recovery of the Kohinnoor Diamond. If you have time please visit -www.kohinnoordiamond.blogspot.com
Dear Thomas, I will
Dear Thomas,
I will definitely visit your blog.
Regards.